[Imc-alternatives] Fwd: Re: [imc-cms] Next Gen CMS Archeticture

Sun Nov 23 17:56:20 PST 2008

On Sun, 2008-11-23 at 09:28 -0800, ryan wrote:
> Yes -- there is a prototype that was created at Techmeet 2008 which is a
> big leap ahead of the project.
> 
> After Techmeet this year, a bunch of CMS programmers headed to Budapest
> for the NODR conference which caused delays. Once this was over, there
> was a major distraction caused by a proposal from the Riseup collective
> which created a few weeks of unproductive argumentation, and just about
> now, things are picking up again on imc-cms ... I wish the process was
> going faster but we are also all balancing this with our lives. Feel
> free to join imc-cms (even in digest mode) to keep up with the latest
> updates, there is some renewed momentum going on right now
> -ryan

I've grabbed the code, and just getting familiar with it now on my local
machine.

will also try and sort out an 'easy install' path for debian based
systems, as installing from source is a pain (all the different
libraries needed, working out what to install etc etc) there's got to be
a simpler way ..

I understand the 'balancing this with our lives' :( time is my enemy
badly, hence not committing, but trying to do something to contribute
along the way as well as keep up with progress etc.

Dave

> 
> Jay wrote:
> > Some info about the new IMC cms.  Seems like there's a 
> > proof-of-concept code out there.
> > 
> > It's tech-heavy e-mail but may make sense to some.
> > 
> > Jay
> > 
> >> From: Occam <indymedia at gmail.com>
> >>
> >> Hi Ben,
> >>
> >> sorry for the late ansfer, but thanks for your message - its good to
> >> see, that you got the main idea.
> >>
> >>
> >>> The discussions in imc-tech have made me very interested in working
> >>> with imc-cms group to get the Indymedia 2.0, or whatever it should be
> >>> called, working and in use.   I took a look at the
> >>> imc-cms.indyarch.pdf files and have a couple questions for folks:
> >>>
> >>> 1) Is there a plan for getting all of this implemented?  If so, what
> >>> has happened so far?
> >> There is some proof of concept python code for the backend and some
> >> more bits and bytes for the frontend. Also hyperactive has a new
> >> approach for the frontend part. http://techmeet.org/txt/CMSFAQ is a
> >> good starting point.
> >>
> >> The Proof of concept code is here: https://codecoop.org/scm/?
> >> group_id=104
> >>
> >>> 2) What is the idea behind the grid management tier?  What problems
> >>> does it solve that aren't handled by having a distributed database?
> >>>
> >> MySQL Replication is hard to do over long distant internet
> >> connections. The global character of indymedia makes a very decentral
> >> server network. This decentralisation is a "must have" for us, to get
> >> around the effects of repression against indymedia.
> >>
> >> The genereal idea is much more about fail-over, decentralisation, and
> >> autonomity(!) of the different modules of a CMS. It is not just about
> >> keeping the data save.
> >>
> >> We dont have a huge need to keep the site up at 99.9%, but we have a
> >> huge need to be able to move sites/modules from one server to another.
> >>
> >> Autonomity means that you seperate the functionality of a CMS over
> >> different servers. If one server is taken away, you lose - for
> >> example the "search" - but your still able to publish informations.
> >> Even if your hole "middle tear" is taken away, and you only have the
> >> DB and static files, you still can pass informations to the public
> >> with "vim index.shtml".
> >>
> >> Autonomity also means that things like the search should have all the
> >> informations they need in a local copy (NOT a cache, a cache is NOT
> >> autonom).
> >>
> >> Also, having very different servers, gives a huge need to a have a
> >> CMS that scales and is flexible.
> >>
> >>> The ones that I got from the PDF were pushing updates for the webapps,
> >>> having a IMC-wide messaging system and keeping track of the latest
> >>> post/latest comments.  Those things are pretty cool, but I don't see
> >>> why they couldn't be handled in a simpler way.  For example a single
> >>> server with a REST API or something.
> >>>
> >>> Is the idea that it would be some sort of ORM system or something?
> >> We had some talk about how to implement it. I personaly prefer to put
> >> the network layer at the "service" level and not down at the
> >> Database. So more like a RPC Interface with services. ICE is doing
> >> this very well. This also gives you a bit more security, since you
> >> can avoid any direct DB access.
> >>
> >> I never worked with REST, i dunno if its a possible solution. But,
> >> public "blog" API's like wordpress has, are things we need to provide
> >> on the frontend level.
> >>
> >>> 3) Would servers in the static tier store all the static files in the
> >>> entire network?  If this is true, I would question if it is
> >>> possible/desirable to do this.  It seems like a huge amount of data to
> >>> me and sets a pretty high barrier to entry.
> >> All IMCs in the indymedia network work autonom and decide on there
> >> own what CMS they us. Some IMCs might just not have the need to use
> >> this new decentral CMS. Its very unlickly that we will end up with
> >> one huge big setup. It is not our goal to have one solution for
> >> everyone.
> >>
> >> However, it would be a good idea to allow the the "splitting" of the
> >> static content. The content type is the best starting point here.
> >> After that a year based seperation was very usefull in the past. If
> >> you have a setup like 2008.img.site.indymedia.org/2008/01/id.jpg,
> >> 2007.audio.site.indymedia.org etc, you scale very well. Static shtml
> >> files dont take so much space and are very to easy handle. For large
> >> video files, you will need a seperated server and transport mechanism
> >> anyway.
> >>
> >> We already have this structure with the current Mir Producer (http://
> >> techmeet.org/txt/CMSProducer)
> >>
> >>> 4) I have a lot of experience doing python web development (and python
> >>> develop in general) and pretty decent PHP experience.  Where can I
> >>> help?
> >>>
> >> Well, check out the proof of concept "malandro" code, its in python
> >> using ice. If you have trouble with the setup, come over to #cms on
> >> irc.indymedia.org or drop me a email. We also have a dev-server for
> >> malandro with a working running setup you can play with.
> >>
> >> We made the proof of concept code as a base and a start and to give
> >> developers something to play with, so they can see the idea.
> >>
> >> So, your very welcome to check it out :)
> >>
> >> occam
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> imc-cms mailing list
> >> imc-cms at lists.indymedia.org
> >> http://lists.indymedia.org/mailman/listinfo/imc-cms
> > 
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-- 
Dave Fregon

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