[Imc-communication] [Imc] UCIMC: Concern about advertisements for Giga-$ non-free software companies

[deva]

On Sep 18, 2006, at 2:00 PM, Mike Lehman wrote:


>
> I do not know whether any of the free software packages you mention  
> were
> available when we made the decision to use said software was made six
> years ago.

So you did not  investigate alternatives back then? or you were not  
around then?


> Notice how my making a point of not further offending you by
> avoiding use of the brand name is rather silly

no, it is you being sarcastic
>

>  Anyway, we now have six years of financial
> data that would need to be converted to something else in order to
> utilize freeware, assuming it is even appropriate. We have plenty of
> work to do without adding a large burden to achieve a result of very
> limited meaning.

I don't think you even bothered to look at the options boud  
suggested. You may as well have just saved all the words you wrote  
and said "We are not interested in exploring such options at this time"

deva





>
> Essentially, yes, our use of this specific software was a tactical
> decision. But I also know that many other IMCs make tactical decisions
> to use commercial software for a variety of tasks, like editing audio
> and video, etc, which is far more directly media-relevant than using
> commercial software for our financial record keeping needs.
>
> I think it's a good thing to encourage as much use of opensource
> software as possible. Thanks for doing that. But I personally would  
> find
> it troublesome and counterproductive if that were an absolute
> requirement. Making people the media is a task that sometimes requires
> people to use the tools they have easily available and know how to  
> use,
> especially if they don't have a lot of technical support expertise in
> their collective. Keeping otherwise viable collectives from becoming
> IMCs because they have only limited opensource support that does not
> meet a certain artificial standard seems problematic to me. I hope  
> that
> isn't happening.
>
> UC IMCs public use computers use a freeware OS. Our website runs  
> Dada, a
> well-known although relatively long-in-tooth opensource system that we
> hope to soon replace. Our LPFM radio station uses some opensource  
> stuff,
> but here again tactical considerations force us to use commercial
> software for certain system, like our required emergency alert system.
> UC IMC fostered CUWin, an opensource wireless internet project that is
> being developed specifically to help communities anywhere to put up
> accessible internet access. We are currently building the new UC IMC
> website with Drupal and will likely develop several IMC-specific  
> modules
> for it so that more IMCs can take advantage of another open source
> option in the future.
>
> I don't think UC IMC has any misunderstandings about the commitment to
> encourage the adoption of freeware, to the extent that it is possible
> and the best tactical solution. Frankly, taking away limited coding  
> and
> administrative resources from media work useful to others in the
> Indymedia network and beyond to try to adapt something to replace our
> current system that may not really be totally suitable seems  
> pointless.
> Like many IMCs, we have "just enough" technical support and a
> not-directly-relevant to media-making project such as you propose  
> would
> be a low priority, even if we want to move in that direction.
>
> Finally, while I think alternative participatory economic ideas are
> something that members of UC IMC generally support and are of  
> interest,
> such a project requires more than a single organization to  
> implement. It
> requires widespread community support from both consumers and  
> producers.
> While such schemes have been discussed in our community in the past,
> they have yet to take root. Certainly, UC IMC will be here and  
> available
> to help with such organizing by providing media and other resources,
> when and if it happens.
>
> So far though, when we have to pay for goods and service, people want
> paid in dollars. We'll keep it in mind. No revolution worth having is
> done in a day.
> Mike Lehman
>
> boud wrote:
>> [to: UC IMC; cc: imc-communication]
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>> -
>> SUMMARY:
>> i'm rather concerned about your announcement about jobs at UCIMC:
>> (0) Evidence: http://www.ucimc.org/mod/info/display/jobs/index.php
>> (1) you have de facto advertisements for non-free Giga-$ software
>> companies
>> (2) you *require* indymedia paid workers to be able to use non-free
>> software
>> (3) you seem to be supporting the use of non-free software companies
>> on a long-term basis.
>> (4) There are plenty of free software packages for financial  
>> management
>> GnuCash: http://gnucash.org/
>> SQL-ledger: http://www.sql-ledger.org/
>> http://cbbrowne.com/info/financefreesoft.html
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>> -
>>
>>
>> Dear ucimc,
>>
>> i'm a volunteer in imc poland, in the local collective in Toruń:
>> http://pl.indymedia.org
>> http://docs.indymedia.org/view/Local/ImcTorun
>> http://lists.indymedia.org/mailman/listinfo/imc-pl-torun
>>
>> i'm also a volunteer in the new-imc working group, where we try to
>> explain to new groups why things like free software are an important
>> part of our struggle to create free media. Making tactical  
>> compromises
>> is understandable.  However, for an experienced imc to make an
>> advertisement for multi-billion dollar companies making non-free
>> software, and, moreover, to start legal, financial relations with
>> "employees" who are expected to support these multi-billion dollar
>> companies making non-free software, seems rather incompatible with
>> indymedia principles. We do not totally exclude compromises with the
>> monetary system, but the political costs should be balanced with the
>> advantages.
>>
>> If one of the oldest imc's seems unable to use free software, this
>> could make it hard to convince new groups of the necessity of  
>> becoming
>> independent from multi-billion dollar corporations.
>>
>>
>>
>> (0) Evidence: Quotes from your job advertisement:
>> http://www.ucimc.org/mod/info/display/jobs/index.php
>>
>>> IMC Treasurer - Job Description
>>> ... manage the bookkeeping of the organization using Quickbooks.
>>
>>> IMC Bookkeeper
>>> Manages and records all IMC financial transactions using Quickbooks,
>>> including bills, invoices, rent, donations, disbursements, etc.
>>
>>> IMC Membership Coordinator
>>> Recieves and enters membership form data using Excel
>>
>>
>>
>> (1) you have de facto advertisements for non-free Giga-$ software
>> companies
>>
>> These ads for Quickbooks and Excel amount to advertisements for:
>>
>> - the $2 billion for-profit company Intuit
>>   Inc. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intuit,_Inc.
>>
>> - one of the world's major sponsors of state terrorism (through
>>   sponsorship of the Republicrat Party in the USA), the multi-billion
>>   dollar corporation Microsoft:
>>   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Microsoft_Excel
>>
>>
>> (2) you *require* indymedia paid workers to be able to use non-free
>> software
>>
>> People who want the UCIMC positions are necessarily going to have to
>> learn to use the software - since it's a requirement presented in the
>> advertisement. They presumably, once employed, will be in a weak  
>> position
>> to insist on switching to free software, since political decisions  
>> should
>> surely be made by the collective of volunteers rather than by paid
>> employeees.
>>
>>
>> (3) you seem to be supporting the use of non-free software companies
>> on a long-term basis.
>>
>>
>> Since UCIMC is one of the oldest IMCs, it's hard to believe that you
>> have never heard of the arguments in favour of free software, or that
>> you do not know how to use google to find free software equivalents.
>>
>> If you really have difficulty finding good free software, you could
>> always write to the imc-tech mailing list:
>>  http://lists.indymedia.org/mailman/listinfo/imc-tech
>>
>> for help in finding free software equivalents. Or even ask informally
>> in many places in the indymedia network.
>>
>>
>>
>> (4) There are plenty of free software packages for financial  
>> management
>>
>> The most obvious alternatives to quickbooks being:
>>
>> GnuCash: http://gnucash.org/
>> SQL-ledger: http://www.sql-ledger.org/
>>
>> You'll find a long list here:
>> http://cbbrowne.com/info/financefreesoft.html
>>
>>
>> As for "Excel", i suggest:
>>
>> gnumeric (standard in any GNU/linux distribution)
>>
>>
>>
>> In case UCIMC has somehow misunderstood the commitment of most  
>> indymedia
>> collectives to the use of free software or doesn't understand its  
>> role
>> in social change movements, here is a quote from the Principles of  
>> Unity:
>>
>> http://docs.indymedia.org/view/Global/PrinciplesOfUnity
>>
>> 9. All IMC's shall be committed to the use of free source code,
>>    whenever possible, in order to develop the digital infrastructure,
>>    and to increase the independence of the network by not relying on
>>    proprietary software.
>>
>>
>> i would suggest that you start reading at:
>>
>> http://www.gnu.org
>>
>>
>> Digital independence is not an issue to be taken lightly.
>>
>> Apart from the political aspect of the question of whether or not to
>> support billion-dollar non-free corporations, this is also an  
>> issue of
>> security for activists - holding their financial and personal
>> information (full names, addresses, bank account numbers? etc.) on a
>> computer running micro$oft is a security risk and unnecessarily makes
>> that information available to state security forces (who can
>> relatively easily crack any micro$oft computer, which by  
>> definition is
>> insecure).
>>
>>
>> solidarity
>> boud (speaking as an individual)
>>
>>
>> PS: My own suggestion if any indymedia collectives wishes to start  
>> having
>> employees would be to experiment with the participatory economics  
>> model:
>>  http://www.parecon.org
>> It does not reject money, but it is a serious attempt at proposing an
>> alternative economic model.
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>> ---
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>> IMC at lists.ucimc.org
>> http://lists.chambana.net/cgi-bin/listinfo/imc
>>
>
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