[New-imc] Online form: Proposed new IMC! (kuna)

Tue Feb 12 14:38:14 PST 2008

hi gregg, all,

On Mon, 11 Feb 2008, Gregg Osofsky wrote:

> Your suggestions sound right on, but I guess I was hoping to get that kind
> of guidance from you all. I'm an experienced web developer,

So you should have no problems reading
  https://docs.indymedia.org/view/Global/NewImcHowTo
and more generally

https://docs.indymedia.org
https://lists.indymedia.org

to get that guidance.

> but I've never
> set up an IMC site and am unfamiliar with how it and the Indymedia Network
> works.

We don't fully know nor agree with one another how our network
functions either. :) But read and observe and propose to Kuna people
to have a go at doing this themselves and they'll form their own
opinion and understanding.

> My main interest in contacting you was to receive guidance in
> addressing #1 and #2 below. Hopefully, our last email to you addresses your
> concerns about our politics so at this point we move forward and get some
> assistance developing a training that accomplishes the goals established by
> our Kuna contacts. I would like to arrive next week with a plan in place so
> your immediate assistance would be greatly appreciated.
>
> Please let me know if you have any further questions and how you suggest we
> proceed at this point.

Hopefully the main confusion will be cleared up if you read
https://docs.indymedia.org/view/Global/NewImcHowTo

If the Kuna people you train decide that something like indymedia is
what they really want, then at that point of time you'll be able to
suggest that *they themselves* send in the form for becoming accepted
into the network as an autonomous indymedia collective.

toya's list of 3 points is also a good outline of a training session.

If you give them a decent presentation/training in those 3 points,
then they'll also realise that creating a cool-looking, open
publishing, open editing website (e.g. which looks close enough to an
indymedia website) can be done in 5 minutes or so (so i've been told,
anyway, e.g. on a wikifarm, but there are probably plenty of other
possibilities).  On the other hand, creating an open, autonomous,
sustainable, networked collective takes a lot more than 5 minutes...

horizontalidad
boud (IMC Torun and new-imc volunteer)

> Gregg
>
> On Feb 11, 2008 1:38 PM, <toya at riseup.net> wrote:
>
>> hi greg and broke,
>> i am writing here my personal opinion, from my own experience working with
>> communities in brasil and all. is great what you are doing, but I have a
>> question, is a common question when you do this type of work so you know
>> the people will be left with something concret, not only receive a
>> trainning and then when folks are gone they have no way to implement why
>> they have learned..most of the time this happen because of lack of
>> resources, that only existed during the trainning because the people who
>> did it was the one who had it with them and after they go home the local
>> ppl has no way to get such resources...
>> if they will learn web design without having a server to pratice, or to
>> upload their work (sites)... how they will use this skill for their
>> struggle? i know what you meant is that you would teach them how to work
>> with one of the cms's imc use.. and then leave up to them if they want to
>> use it or not.
>> but i would suggest that you first propose to them:
>>
>> 1. indymedia network presentation - how is organized, global lists, how to
>> join them, how a collective is build (new imc process), how the sites are
>> normally builded, how techs are organized within indymedia network etc.
>>
>> 2. independent host services, like linefeed, riseup, noblogs, sarava,
>> birosca, etc. how they are important and how to contact them...
>>
>> 3. basic on web design, how internet works (what is a web server etc)
>>
>> maybe doing like this, when you are done with 1, 2, 3, it will be more
>> clear for them how it all works and how they can use the new skill within
>> the network of people who works with the same thing and provides support
>> for it.
>>
>> just my personal opinion...
>> to make sure that after you leave they can move on without you and know
>> all the options they have... number 1 and 2 are very important for it!
>> bye bye
>> toya
>>> Hi IMC folks,
>>>
>>> I think that you raise a very important concern, that we certainly will
>> be
>>> in a better position to address when we are with the Kuna. However, I
>>> think
>>> we are dealing with a chicken and egg issue here, in that we have been
>>> asked
>>> by the Kuna to teach web design to 10 youth from the community. It is
>> our
>>> feeling that the Indymedia network is the best interface for the Kuna to
>>> be
>>> able to get their message out to the world. They have had difficulty in
>>> past
>>> with getting their struggle publicized. In order to be able to offer the
>>> Indymedia format for them to choose as an option, we would love to have
>>> your
>>> assistance in preparing to present this option to them.  We are not in
>> any
>>> way suggesting that we would either start the site nor run the site, we
>>> will
>>> merely be offering technical assistance and training. The rest is up to
>>> them.
>>>
>>> Please let us know,
>>>
>>> Gregg and Brooke
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Feb 9, 2008 11:30 PM, nick <sarsnic at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I bet it would be an uphill battle to get this imc through the process
>>>> of joining the network.  People would all be wondering how you could
>>>> have a consensus decision making process with this group you haven't
>>>> met yet and wouldn't be able to hold meetings with.  It it could be
>>>> seen as people in the global north trying to set up an IMC for a group
>>>> in the global south, instead of providing resources for them to do it
>>>> themselves.  This is all just my personal opinion.
>>>>
>>>> peace,
>>>> Nick
>>>>
>>>> On 09/02/2008, gosofsky at gmail.com <gosofsky at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>> Submitted by: Gregg Osofsky <gosofsky at gmail.com> on Saturday,
>> February
>>>> 9th, 2008 @ 9:35:06 am (-0800)
>>>>>
>>>>> Client Variables
>>>>> ----------------
>>>>>
>>>>> HTTP_USER_AGENT:
>>>>> Mozilla/5.0 (Macintosh; U; Intel Mac OS X; en-US; rv:1.8.1.12)
>>>> Gecko/20080201 Firefox/2.0.0.12
>>>>>
>>>>> Online Form Fields
>>>>> ------------------
>>>>>
>>>>> proposed_imc_name:
>>>>> kuna
>>>>>
>>>>> proposed_imc_url:
>>>>> kuna.indymedia.org
>>>>>
>>>>> current_url:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> city:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> state:
>>>>> Kuna Yala
>>>>>
>>>>> country:
>>>>> Panama
>>>>>
>>>>> contact_name:
>>>>> Gregg Osofsky
>>>>>
>>>>> contact_email:
>>>>> gosofsky at gmail.com
>>>>>
>>>>> contact_phone:
>>>>> 917-886-2852
>>>>>
>>>>> tech_name:
>>>>> Gregg Osofsky
>>>>>
>>>>> tech_email:
>>>>> gosofsky at gmail.com
>>>>>
>>>>> tech_phone:
>>>>> 917-886-2852
>>>>>
>>>>> focus:
>>>>> regional_focus
>>>>>
>>>>> critical_dates:
>>>>> March 14, 2008
>>>>>
>>>>> supporting_groups:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> introductory_statement:
>>>>> I represent a 3-person delegation traveling to the Kuna Yala
>> territory
>>>> of Panama to document the struggles facing the Kuna people. We have had
>>>> contact with the Kuna since 1999, but this is the first effort to
>>>> connect
>>>> them with the international community in a substantive way. We intend
>> to
>>>> provide training to enable them to build and develop their indymedia
>> and
>>>> web
>>>> presence.
>>>>>
>>>>> resources:
>>>>> Audio and video production, web design and production, political
>>>> organizing, and a fair amount of server space/bandwidth if needed.
>>>>>
>>>>> outreach:
>>>>> We have been in communication with members of the Kuna for the past 8
>>>> years. Furthermore, we have met with UN representatives as well as
>>>> leaders
>>>> of several NGOs representing Indigenous peoples.
>>>>>
>>>>> identity_makeup:
>>>>> We have not yet arrived in the Kuna region, but our tour of the
>> region
>>>> will take us through many of the various tribal areas and communities.
>>>>>
>>>>> steps_represent_diversity:
>>>>> One of the primary goals of our trip is to train the Kuna to develop
>>>> and
>>>> produce their own media. In addition to training individuals in
>>>> audio/video
>>>> editing, we will teach a group of younger Kuna how to produce and
>>>> maintain
>>>> web pages/sites.
>>>>>
>>>>> steps_involve_new_workfields:
>>>>> Much of the training will be with the Kuna youth, both male and
>>>> female.
>>>>>
>>>>> username:
>>>>> Gregg Osofsky
>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> New-imc mailing list. Lista de correo New-imc
>>> New-imc at lists.indymedia.org
>>> http://lists.indymedia.org/mailman/listinfo/new-imc
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>